In this explosive mega interview with renowned finance and economic expert, political analyst and remembered as former Minister of Finance, Dzevdet Hajredini, we speak about the most current Macedonian topics and processes. According to him, Ali Ahmeti and his DUI are one of the key factors in impeding the reforms and the progress in Macedonia.
Hajredini for CIVIL MEDIA, without hesitations, sharply, directly and precisely, comments the announcements for possible early parliamentary elections, the problems related to the State Commission for Prevention of Corruption, the relations between DUI and VMRO-DPMNE, but also with SDSM, the Prespa Agreement, the influences and the interests of Russia and Turkey.
CIVIL MEDIA: Mr. Hajredini, we regularly consult you in regards to the important processes and events in Republic of Macedonia, and I thank you for being with us today in CIVIL. Today we would like to talk about several important issues. First of all, can Macedonia endure another process of early parliamentary elections? Is the system being prepared for a good, professional, legally carried out process, or perhaps early parliamentary elections will just additionally shock the system and the society and will cause such consequences that we do not want to see, especially in this delicate period/
HAJREDINI: In my opinion, with this announcement, that the possibility of announcing early elections is not excluded, I consider that this set that is in power cannot make a bigger mistake for Macedonia. Almost two years were waited for the new government to start working in the direction of eliminating all the inherited conditions of the previous government of the VMRO-DPMNE and DUI coalition. I think that all of us who were supporting the entire change, and who gave support to SDSM and Zoran Zaev, did it with hope that, nevertheless, not too much time would be lost for the new, radical changes to begin in Macedonia.
Until a few days ago, until the adoption of the amendments of the Constitution, resulting from the Prespa Agreement, we were all in some kind of suspense, waiting for all of that to pass, and to finally see real changes. Now it’s absurd to go to elections, in the year in which Europe is expecting the reforms to be implemented in the judiciary and state administration. The Government itself is announcing an economic year. I personally think that it is absurd, because not any year should be proclaimed as economic, because every year should be economic, regardless of what kind of problems there are in the country. Because the economy is a precondition for the existence of people…The government has instruments that are not intended for solving other problems, but are just for the economy.
And now, all of a sudden, to mention elections, this would mean postponing the reforms. What kind of reforms are we going to make until June? And in the meanwhile we know what the European Commission is expecting now in the reforms. That means another lost year. Therefore, I think that for me, and for the citizens, it is shocking, to enter again in new elections, as if VMRO-DPMNE is important.
I think that VMRO-DPMNE will now have to deal a lot more with itself, more than ever before. The main thing they were holding on to has finished. It definitely ended. That is why I think it is a big mistake to enter in new elections.
CIVIL MEDIA: How can early parliamentary elections affect the economy?
HAJREDINI: Extremely negatively! We still don’t have other measures that are a condition for reviving the economy. We know that in the region we have the lowest rate of economic growth. We are still ranging with projections of 2.5% or 3.2% and etc… While Kosovo, for example, has a 4.5% increase. The same with Albania. Serbia as well. The least we need is to have elections and to say that 2019 will be an economic year. It is extremely absurd, and for me it is beyond my understanding.
Furthermore, this year will be the most economic year in Macedonia, when the reforms in the state administration and in the judiciary will be implemented. With these two fundamental reforms, Macedonia is automatically becoming a country with fulfilled conditions to deal with the economy. Bujar Osmani, who is making statements that soon we will have all the reforms, is the head of that Committee for reforms, and he is not exactly the best choice for being the head of those processes in Macedonia, and the Prime Minister knows this very well. This is so precisely because even Zaev himself has noted him as being the carrier of corrupted steps. And now things have gone even further, which is even more absurd, in not having other Albanians, because the other deputy doesn’t go to work, right, he receives a salary and stays at home, so Bujar Osmani was put coordinator of the construction of the new highway section on the highway to Kosovo. How can these things be explained?
If the reforms in the judiciary and state administration are implemented, then DUI’s cadre, Nikola Gruevski’s most loyal associates, cannot remain untouched.
CIVIL MEDIA: You recently said that the State Commission for Prevention of Corruption in 2003 had a budget three times smaller than the one in 2016. We still don’t have complete data for 2017 and 2018. However, you also have a comment according to which the State Commission for Prevention of Corruption had zero effect from its existence and from its work. The SCPC is one of the most important institutions when speaking about the electoral processes, and certainly also for other fields in society and the system, especially in the fight against corruption. How do you see the role of the SCPC, and how do you comment the fact that there is no leadership, that is, members of the Commission for almost an entire year?
HAJREDINI: I have already commented and warned that the elections are impossible without an Anticorruption commission, and about the opinion that we haven’t had an Anticorruption commission 8 or 10 months. Well, Macedonia hasn’t had an Anticorruption commission for ten years! Seriously speaking, there is no commission! We know what that commission had been working. It hadn’t been doing anything! They had had an agreement with a hotel near the main office, for them to go to the fitness center during work. And then the commission ended just like it began, infamously and disgracefully!
In addition to the salaries they had been receiving, the budget of the commission since 20013 had went up 565.000 euros. So, this needs to be addressed! The Commission is not the only one responsible for this. The Government of the Republic of Macedonia is also responsible for allowing the institutions to act in such a way.
On Facebook, when I commented that this is stealing money from the poor citizens of Macedonia, a friend of mine, an intellectual, called me and said “Where are there institutions and bodies that haven’t been misused?”. Yes, indeed, there has been misuse everywhere. But, precisely this Commission has the task of revealing and prosecuting all those other institutions and bodies where there has been stealing.
CIVIL MEDIA: Well, perhaps the increase in the budget of the State Commission for Prevention of Corruption can also mean that the state, namely, the Government and Parliament want to seriously engage in the fight against corruption. And at the same time, let’s not forget also that the SCPC was not entirely inactive in the time of Gruevski. This is exactly the institution that gave an order for the NGOs that do not think in the same way as Gruevski’s regime to be prosecuted. Certainly, this is in the ironic sense of the word. But, according to you, can the SCPC grow into an institution that will fight decisively, consistently and professionally against corruption in the country?
HAJREDINI: Unfortunately, it cannot. Because, as I have been reading these days, in the attempts to compose and appoint a new Commission, there have been reasonable proposals for there to be three or five members, who will be efficient and outside of any party influence, but because of DUI’s resistance they have not succeeded in that intention.
The parties again will be giving, not five, but seven members, so that Ali Ahmeti can accommodate his cadre that has no qualifications, so that they can continue to work according to the goals and intentions of the leader of DUI. And now I hear that it is how it will pass in Parliament. Hence, a climate and preparedness have still not been created in Macedonia, not incidentally, because of the resistance to the reforms that will appear now in DUI.
DUI will not allow neither a reform of the electoral system, nor of the state administration or of the judiciary, because if they do not provide space for them to select the cadre that will be allocated in the institutions, in the judiciary and so on, then they will not have any votes among the Albanians. The government of Gruevski and of Zaev allowed DUI to pay their voters out of the budget, sending money to thousands of people at home. And then they will brag, as Bujar Osmani is bragging now that if they go to elections they can double the result.
CIVIL MEDIA: Can they double the result?
HAJREDINI: If Zaev acts the same as in the local elections, with money from the state to continue to pay their voters, which is a phenomenon, unknown in the world, then they can. A phenomenon! Whereas Bujar Osmani comes out and talks about European standards in the state administration. What kind of a European standard is that, to pay money from the budget to people who have never, in years, showed up to work? That is a European standard?
The list from the Secretariat for the implementation of the Ohrid Agreement continues even now. That is political corruption! Let the Prime Minister come out and answer the question according to which law is that money paid out from the budget?
CIVIL MEDIA: Where can the Albanian voters in Republic of Macedonia turn to in order to express their political will? How can their political expectations be articulated?
HAJREDINI: For now, with such coalition partners of DUI, like VMRO-DPMNE, and, unfortunately, SDSM as well, it is almost impossible to get out of this situation.
CIVIL MEDIA: But you say, for completely clear reasons, that there shouldn’t be elections. This also coincides with DUI’s fear from the elections, regardless of what Dui can claim regarding the prognosis and how they will come out at such elections. Your arguing your views also against the elections goes in their favor. What can actually be done to avoid the situations for which you are talking about, such as the political corruption, low standards in terms of the administration, the budget spending and so on? Isn’t it still better to organize early parliamentary elections?
HAJREDINI: Well, look at the goal. The situation of 2014 and 2016 will be repeated. They do want elections now, but DUI will say: no changes in the Voters Register, according to the Przino Agreement. Therefore, if DUI does not succeed to prevent the elections, then they will fiercely resist any such change to the electoral system, because it suits them in order for them to win again those ten MPs.
CIVIL MEDIA: The electoral system, of course, cannot be changes just a few months before the elections are held…
HAJREDINI: Well that reason alone is enough for there not be early parliamentary elections. in order for a new system to be built. A system of open lists and etc… Ali Ahmeti cannot be allowed to have the right to make people candidates for MPs (I quote him) “who cannot even work as house painters’.
The opinions of the Venice Commission, and of Priebe as well, are that the “bombs” should be published, and even the private ones if they concern the public interest. That was the direction for Macedonia to overcome the crisis. In that case, all those who for ten years have been bringing Macedonia to this situation would have been dealt with and gone to jail. It would have served as an example for future politicians. We can see that if all those crimes are pardoned that DUI will again fiercely resist the possible transformation of the Special Prosecutor’s Office.
This is what Europe is seeking. And it is obvious that neither Zaev, nor SDSM have the strength to carry it out, for Macedonia to definitely clear the remainders and filthiness that we have been seeing for years in this country.
All projects where DUI cadre is responsible, and I will number them if you would like, are not completed. The reconstruction of the theatre on Bit Pazar is going on for five years. Five years! Ten annexes! Now the reconstruction of the theatre in Tetovo is beginning, and 13 million are already spent. Now, Zaev is making that cadre a coordinator on another project worth 110 million euros, and that is the highway. Well, there’s going to be exploiting there for years! These are the real problems for which Zaev should seriously think about. And not give Teuta Arifi 200.000 euros before the local elections to dislocate the landfill a kilometer away. And all of this from our money! Why is he giving money before elections? for her to win the elections. The construction of the water supply in Tetovo lasted seventeen years. 17 years! The Ohrid Framework Agreement is being implanted for 17 years! And then they will say we are for integration into the EU and NATO.
CIVIL MEDIA: Does this mean that you actually think that DUI is working for the interests of VMRO-DPMNE, and not for the general interest?
HAJREDINI: Well first of all, they were united with VMRO-DPMNE. Then, there was a time when we hoped that there would also be differentiation in DUI, that those who had deeply gotten stuck in the cooperation with Gruevski would be cleaned, because there are people who are minding their business there too.
However, they are keeping the top, together with Ali Ahmeti, as captives to their policies. You know, I have written this long time ago, even back in the Przino negotiations, personally Van Hautte wrote that Dui is working under the pressure of VMRO-DPMNE. I have had the opportunity to talk with him about what kind of pressure it was. He says “he supported me a long time, and then Gruevski asked for a break to consult with Ali Ahmeti, and when he returned, he changes his standpoint”.
CIVIL MEDIA: Finally, the Macedonian part of the Prespa Agreement has been completed and fulfilled with the voting in Parliament. What perspectives do you see for the Prespa Agreement? Will it be ratified by Greece and what does the Prespa Agreement and the overcoming of the dispute with Greece mean for Macedonia?
HAJREDINI: We who remember and have been analyzing in the past 30 years, think that the maximum success of Macedonia and the Macedonian people in their history, has so far been the status of a federal unit in then Yugoslavia. It hasn’t been an independent state, a sovereign independent state in history, if we don’t count what Gruevski was saying that we had been independent before 2000 years ago.
This is though the first condition for the Macedonian people and citizens to constitute such an independent and sovereign member state of the international community. Up to this agreement, it wasn’t sure whether it would happen at all. With the conclusion of this Agreement, I think there is not a force that can stop us. What is fortunate for Macedonia and the Macedonian citizens is that it coincided with the strategic interests of the great powers. I also sincerely hope that there won’t be any new obstacles.
It is obvious that the procedure for ratification of the Prespa Agreement will pass in Greece.
CIVIL MEDIA: Do you interpret the pressure in, practically, the last and the conditions that Biljal Kasami and his part of the Besa party imposed as a normal and everyday political activity, or is there perhaps a wider and different context?
HAJREDINI: There is no wider, or any other context. I will just remind you. When the two parties were being established two years ago, Besa came out with one program aim – redefining Macedonia. that redefining was undefined. They didn’t mention what kind of redefining it is about. The Alliance of the Albanians of Sela came out with a position for federalization. I have had the opportunity to talk with their people even back in that time, saying that they shouldn’t be setting abstract goals, because they don’t lead anywhere.
These two parties have not only not done anything in that sense, but they also haven’t even mentioned that anymore, but are waiting in line for Zaev, to enter with one or half a minister in the Government. They are not mentioning the redefining or the federalization anymore, rather, have become four entities out of two.
Let’s be clear, Kasami never said that he would block the amendments, but the demands. And at the end it came down to not touching the amendments at all, with the exception of a few words upon the proposal of the Alliance of the Albanians, after which, supposedly, some goal was achieved.
Here Zaev is expected to use tactics. With words, to give them something, with a law or similar. So I did not see, nor was there any other deeper goal. Kasami was angry because Zaev chose the other wing. And this was because of pragmatic reasons. They have three MPs, while Kasami has two. This is what it all came down to and how it ended at the end.
CIVIL MEDIA: Do you think that certain political structures and circles in Republic of Macedonia are working in conjunction with, or in favor of the Russian interests of the Russian agents? In that sense, should we consider as such only those who are obviously and declaratively standing on the side of the Russian interests, like Levica and United Macedonia, and certainly Mickoski and his part of VMRO-DPMNE? Is the list of political parties and politicians perhaps longer, and can they too find themselves in the campus of the Albanian political parties and entities?
HAJREDINI: Russia, if it manages to do something here with these tiny spy things, then it would be to tie Macedonia with Serbia’s philosophy, not to join NATO. But it is not engaging too much. The thing is, if the intelligent services succeed in doing something, then good, but if they don’t, then let them carry on. It’s not what Mirka Velinovska was writing, that Macedonia is Russia’s first victory over the US.
These things were, and still are just exaggerations. They are spending some money, and Russia has all the money for that purpose. Both Lavrov and Putin said publically that the name dispute will be as it will be agreed. They said declaratively that they are against Macedonia joining NATO, but that’s all! It doesn’t come into consideration for them to take bigger steps for Macedonia. Because Russia bargains with the US for other bigger problems, and not for Macedonia. Because there’s no importance. Macedonia is geographically inside NATO. Greece, Turkey, Bulgaria, Romania, Moldavia, they’re all there, and for Macedonia that doesn’t change much.
The Albanian people as a whole cannot be for Russia. They are western-oriented both by history and culture.
CIVIL MEDIA: Where is the Turkish influence here, that is, the Turkish interests, I refer to Erdogan’s Turkey, in Macedonia?
HAJREDINI: I think that Turkey’s attitude towards Macedonia is tied to Turkey’s relations with Greece. It favors Macedonia.
It’s different with the Albanian factor. Because Turkey is a member of NATO, a strong country, and we are also tied to the fact that the majority of us are a Muslim population and so the support of Turkey in given moments is needed. In 1997, when there was a crisis in Albania, when parts of South Albania could have separated and joined Greece, the Prime Minister of Turkey, Tansu Ciller, publically came out and told Greece “if an inch of Albania is brought into question, there go your islands in the Aegean Sea”.
Therefore, if such sensitive moments do come, Turkey is entirely on the side of the Albanians, and of Albania. It also fiercely supports Kosovo, even though it maintains good relations with Serbia as well.
The conversation was led by: Xhabir Deralla
Text editing: Маја Ivanovska
Camera: Dehran Muratov
Editing: Arian Mehmeti
Photography: Biljana Jordanovska
Translation: Natasa Cvetkovska
